Frances Hargraves - on being the first certified special education teacher in Orange County (clip)

FH: at that time it was hard to find qualified teachers. That's why they sent me. I was the first teacher in Orange County to be certified to teach special education. So I ran a lot of workshops. And when I came back, UNC, this university up here sent students to me to train.

BG: In teaching learning disabilities? Attention deficit disorders, dyslexia?

FH: All of it. Right. So for eighteen years-I stayed in it twenty years-for eighteen years I had teachers in my room. Even as far as Greensboro, Durham, training teachers. A lot of people ask me about charter schools. The first thing I say is charter schools take in a wide range. But I have worked with children with trainable children. I've worked with children who have behavior disorders. I've worked even with exceptional, talented children. I've worked with three or four different kinds. I say the charter schools, some of them are really on the right track. But what is needed most is well-trained teachers. You've got to know what you 're doing, what approaches.

BG: I wish we had time to go into that a little more and maybe we will ( ).

FH: Right. You have more now than you ever had. People are going in all specialties. Just like doctors.

BG: I wanted to get on and talk about Lincoln High School. I know you didn't teach there. But I also know that you were in teaching, that you were in the community ( ). And so you must have some impressions about what Lincoln High School was, the teachers there, the attitudes there. I wonder if you could just take off and talk about Lincoln High School.

FH: I was at Lincoln High School for ten years.

BG: You were?

FH: Yes. I was with Mr. McDougle. Mr. McDougle and Mr. Peace.

BG: Mr. Peace was the principal at Northside?

FH: Yes. The building itself. I was in that building. I taught with Mr. McDougle in 4th to 6th grade. Mr. McDougle was a good disciplinarian. What had happened before Mr. McDougle came, there was a lot of looseness, of students roaming around in the streets, trying to imitate, I guess, the college people. The behavior problems, kids seemed to be out of tune. When they hired Mr. McDougle, he had an overall picture of just what had happened. What they needed: more restrictions of students leaving, or students getting down to the work. When he came in as principal some students might have had the idea, since they had all that looseness, that he was really very strict.